Breeding priorities

[CarolU]

As we approach a new breeding season, I wanted to know what mare owners consider when looking at a potential stallion.

[Paula]

The three P's are what I look for in a breeding stallion;

Performance
Pedigree
Progeny

[Kerry W]

Color, color, color, cost, cost, cost. ;-)

Confo, natural gait, disopsition...in that order.

[moonrize]

Natural gait, conformation, disposition, in that order for me. Sometimes horses who don't have the most perfect conformation actually have the perfect conformation for gait. They may be a little sickle hocked or have a slightlly fat neck - which I wouldn't mind. Major flaws, uhm, no, couldn't deal with regardless of gait. Color is nice and I like my duns, but my best horse is a solid bay with out a stitch of white. Bought solely for his FANTASTIC gait and disposition (he's a gelding, so his conformation isn't perfect, but that doesn't matter since I'm not breeding him).

I don't look at bloodlines for what's "in" this year, but rather for the prepotency of the line to produce the characteristics I like in a horse. For instance I like medium to low brio, so I don't breed for a hot horse and tend to stay away from lines that have the tendency to be known as "hot".

I do think every breeding should be thought about and the resulting foal's use too. Just breeding because you have a mare or stallion doesn't make any sense to me. Breed to improve the breed, not just for a foal.

[Blameitonbrio]

1. Disposition
2. & 3. Conformation & Natural Gait (can't decide between these right now!)
4. & 5. Speed of footfall & Action (I prefer less)
6. Color
7. & 8. Cost & Convenience (can't decide)

To me, disposition is most important. We can only keep a few horses, and I have to make sure that the ones we keep are ones we can live with. One like my Sweet Marisa is perfect in that department!

I would say Natural Gait is second, but I don't want to look at a conformational trainwreck either, so those two are hard to choose between.

As for animation and speed of footfall, I am not into the fino-type horses, so I prefer less. That being said, I love watching fino and performance at shows and they make my heart beat faster...I just don't want one for our purposes.

Color...I don't believe that breeding for color is a good policy if it is at the expense of disposition, gait and conformation; however, I would place color over cost and convenience, because I am a visual person. I like things to look a certain way, and that includes color. Of course, there aren't many color I don't like!

Cost and Conveniece are tied together for me. There are cases in which cost will rise to number one, because no matter how great the disposition, a lot of horses are simply out of my price range! :shock: And as far as convenience in breeding, well AI can solve that problem and I like the idea of it being done at a vet's office anyway -- 'cause I am new at this.

Good questions Carol!

[Terry Wallace]

These polls are cool... I like how you cannot see the responses until you cast a vote....

No surprise to me confo is winning! AND...."yeah" for that...

My order is: Confo, Natural gait, disposition...

However...I'd rule out ANY horse that did not have a good disposition....
First of all..... I look for confo..."generally" other items will fall into place, if you have good confo to begin with. If you have good confo, you likley already have good gait....

I cannot remember the rest of the listed items....

Cost..not really a factor for me...after all...in Paso Finodom....you can breed to the best horses all day long for $3,500 (or less)....which is a pitance, compared to say TB's.... this fact still amazes me to this day...
But it equally amazes me that owners of totally unproven stallions, automatically assume their horse should command $1,000 right from the get go.... those are ones to be careful on.... you can breed to extremely GOOD horses for $1,000-$1,500...or you can breed to absolute CRAP for the same figure....

[paintedhorizon]

Conformation
Disposition
Natural gait
Cost
Color
Speed of footfall
Action (animation when gaiting)
Conveinence

[Linda Y]

I don't breed any more, but if I did, first and foremost would be for disposition. Then gait. Then conformation. A lovely horse is nothing if it won't gait or if it is a snot. Form follows function so they say.

[SandyMM]

We breed for pleasure/trail and possible endurance prospects, so our priorities are:

natural gait - we want to spend our time riding, not training gait
disposition - friendly with 'adjustable brio'
conformation - solid and durable
action - no extremes - enough to clear trail obstacles, not so much as to waste energy on long rides
color - don't really care, but we currently have mahoghany bay, chestnut, and buckskin with probable smutty/smoke black

Most of our stock comes from - or has a good dose of - successful past show ring contenders from close-up old bloodlines. We are very proud to say that our two breeding stallions are known for their excellent dispositions and are great ambassadors - especially for newcomers to the breed who might be a bit intimidated by the expectation/perception of excessively hot blood.

While color is of relatively low importance to us personally, our trimmer says she would buy a palomino colt or filly from our stock in a heartbeat. :D

[PASOFAN]

-Natural gait
-Disposition
-Confo
-Action
-Cost
-Color

I dont breed but I know when I look for a paso I want that gait to be there #1.

[GeorgeGuns]

Natural gait first, a Paso Fino must gait!
Close seconds and tied for it are disposition and conformation. I think Disposition is in part given genetically, and in part influenced by US, and I think natural gait is in a large part dependant of good conformation anyway. Since i don't breed for show as a priority, there are a few faults I can live with - like a thicker throat latch, mild (I mean mild) cow hocks. I can't live with sickle hocks or other leg problems, poor croups, bad shoulders..
Third is color - hey I do have THE black roan stallion, do I want color? hehehe
Speed of footfall is fourth, not so important to me as correct gait, and speed can be helped with careful training. That's not to say I don't have a few fastfooted horses here!
I probably should have placed action higher, because I do prefer lower action but with the ability to get out of their own way. And it can be a determinant for a hrose that may show in the future as to what class it will be appropriate for.
Cost and convenience.. negatives, lol. Breeding is NOT convenient, and its not free either! Its a pain in the buttt. But the payoff in seeing a good foal hit the ground, gait off next to mommy, and come back and give a fuzzy foal kiss.. well, that kind of makes up for all the trouble, eh?

What we look for in my farm... in order from most important to not so important.

1- Performance under saddle.
2- Speed of footfall.
3- Action.
4- Color. We like sealed colors.
5- Conformation

Disposition isn't a big factor in our breeding as we search for brio (spirit).
Whats most important in selecting stallions for all of our mares is what the stallion has produced. HAS to be in gait we are breeding for PASO FINO and not trocha or anything else.

Our mares this year have already had thier stallions choosen we will be picking Capuchino, hopefully Patrimonio del Ocho and if not Amadeus or Tormento and finally Capitan de La Vitrina.

[Abejita]

Disposition isn't a big factor in our breeding as we search for brio (spirit).

Please explain this.You make it sound as if a horse that has brio doesnt have a good disposition.

Brio has little to do with disposition.IMO

What do you mean by sealed colors?

[pasolucy]

Disposition is number one for me, natural gait, conformation. I do like to breed for color, with AI conveinence is not important,cost of corse would be a factor. The market that I would be selling too is not interested in speed of footfall or action. They want a nice smooth sensible horse and size would be a big consideration, you may put that into conformation but I must have a horse over 14 hands to have a market for it here.

[DebbieS]

I'm breeding my mare this season.

Disposition is number one (I have children and non-riders)
Natural Gait (in my case, that isn't an issue but would be if it were Paso)
Color
Conformation
Cost

[LynnG]

I will take it from a viewpoint as if I was looking for a breeding mare prospect as I have a stallion that has the characteristics I desire, so looking for complimentary matches for him.

Pedigree/ancestors probably is #1...as it will get my attention to ask for photos and more information, if I am familiar with the horses on paper and know what their gait tends to be, what their conformation, gait etc generally is like.

From there, I will want to see visuals/photos next as in certain views of the horse's conformation #2. The horse needs to have sound balanced conformation, an expresssive look (depicts possible disposition).

At the same time I ask to see conformation photos, I ask about disposition (any bad habits/vices and level of rider experience needed), and degree of natural gait. Natural gait is ... as shows some pasture paso gaits and/or will lead in gait when asked..and waht gait they prefer under saddle when ridden with light contact. Disposition is a willing attitude to learn and not an overly nervous horse...a horse with smarts! Suitable and safe for amateur owners to handle.

Certain colors I prefer not to use in my breeding program, so would be a turn-off if I was shopping say for a mare or if the mare happened to be bred and the foal was included...what the selling point was in that sire ...if color was the main one, I'd be turned off but maybe temporarily, if I felt the market for selling the resulting foal was vastly different then what I market.

Too small "pony" size I would avoid... 13.2 and under. I prefer to look at 14 hh-14.3 hh range. 13.3 hh size I can rationalize if all the other "qualities" desired are in place, and that the horse has taller size in its ancestors. I do have customers seriously looking for under 14 hand horses as they are short adults. But in my case..my height (5'8")/size if I am doing the riding and training..I'd prefer not to ride a 13.2 hh Paso. I like one around 14.1 hh, now that I am middle-age and I'm not so flexible getting on and off. My 15 hh mare is a long stretch for my legs when saddled.

So for me it is really more about the horse has to have the complete package: Conformation, Natural Gait, Disposition and desired Pedigree...for a breeding prospect. I also like to see what they have produced in offspring to get an idea of what they can potentially produce.
8-)

[Wendy]

1. Natural gait- without the natural gait it's not a paso fino
2. Disposition- life is too short to deal with anyone or anythings bad attitude.
3. Conformation- increases the likely hood of a healthy and sound life for the horse.
4. Pedigree-some lines are known for certain qualities both positive and negative.
5. Rapid foot fall- It's so much fun to ride!!

I'm like most people, I want a fino champion that is naturally gaited, easy to ride, beginner safe, perfect conformation and pedigree, sweet as a kitten and palomino. I just don't understand why I can't find this horse in my price range! ;-)

[diswick]

Gait--these are gaited horses, so, very important.
Disposition--I hate being around a horse with a bad attitude.
Conformation--without good conformation how can a horse do its job, which is gait? These horses are conformed to gait.

I don't care how fast or how high they pick em up and lay em down. And pedigree is important, but in the end it is the horses close up on the papers who make the biggest impact. Parents and grandparents. Not too many throwbacks around...

I think I am over showing. I consider it every year--the Earl Warren Showground is just down the road. But then I go to one show early in the year, and see the stress the riders, trainers, horses and Moms are going through, and think to myself that I am happy to be done with that. If I breed a horse that is show quality then I will be riding a darn pretty horse down the road, through the woods, and on the beach.

Disposition has to do with brio. Not many nice horses ( the one's that little kids and beginers can get on) have brio. Try putting a kid or beginer on a horse with brio.. It's not going to be a nice scene.

Sealed colors.. We dont like white boots or stars or spots.

[Ginger]

Something the other horses don't have, and that wasn't listed on the poll.

Anybody can bread for gait, color, conformation, and all that you listed. What makes a stallion breedable is that factor that makes him "Pop" like a certain piece of jewelry, a sunset, aurorae borealis, you know what I mean- a surreal, extra-special factor.

I know of many well-conformed, superlative stallions. There's only ONE Sultan's Great Day, ONE Capuchino (despite people riding the name coattails most undeservingly), ONE Khemosabi, Zippo Pine Bar, you get the idea.

After a while, it looks like they start rolling off a factory assembly line, all the same. It's boring.

[motorgypsy]

Crystal you really hit the proverbial nail on the head. If the mare or stallion doesn't have that something special that literally takes our breath away we don't buy or breed to it.

Thinking about the shopping process we go through before buying or breeding - if a stallion lunges at the window of his stall or snaps his teeth at us as we pass - we pass on him.

We were thinking about breeding to another stallion but went to see him in person. Terrible sickle hocks and very poor conformation. Forget that one.

If the horse is trained we need to be able to ride it. It needs to show us that it is intelligent, willing and tractable. High energy but controlled, and Not lazy or flighty. Disposition.

Nito if you think disposition isn't important it's just because you already have the one you want. Brio doesn't mean uncontrolled or crazy. It means as hot as you want - controlled fire - but safe for a baby. We have several like this. Point them toward a barrel, signal to move out - full gallop from the first step. No kicking, no whips - controlled fire. The other day we led a 64 year old lady who'd never ridden a horse around on one. She walked like her foal was under her feet. Two minutes later we were finoing and galloping around the arena, spinning and stopping on a dime. What a rush! Heart and disposition, brains and power. The perfect horse.

Gait must be not only correct but smooth and balanced.

Now do we ever comrpomise? Yes - if the paso fino has that special something that makes us gasp when we see them move and when we ride them ride them.

Hmmm gypsy you're kinda right but the obvious is im not going to pick a stallion that wont let you groom him or compete. Brio to a extent you know what I mean.

[motorgypsy]

After years of rental horses we love 'em hot but not crazy, mean, lazy or dumb! Our stallion has a bit of an attitude - he is territorial and we had to have a word of prayer when we first got him but he is a dream to ride and not mean, agressive or dumb. So responsive - like driving a tornado.

[El Indio Elegante]

What we look for in my farm... in order from most important to not so important.

1- Performance under saddle.
2- Speed of footfall.
3- Action.
4- Color. We like sealed colors.
5- Conformation

Disposition isn't a big factor in our breeding as we search for brio (spirit).
Whats most important in selecting stallions for all of our mares is what the stallion has produced. HAS to be in gait we are breeding for PASO FINO and not trocha or anything else.

Our mares this year have already had thier stallions choosen we will be picking Capuchino, hopefully Patrimonio del Ocho and if not Amadeus or Tormento and finally Capitan de La Vitrina.

I would have to agree on most of this except for the color and the disposition. To me as long as the horse can be handled without extreme danger okay. Color to me i really don't care

[Rose Mary Axell]

Conformation - With out good conformation the horse will not stand up over the long haul! This is very important to me as a breeder. I will accept some slight conformation faults if they do not affect the horse’s strength or movement as long as the rest of the package is what I want.

Disposition - This is a major concern as we are breeding for family and trail horses. I do not want any "wild ones". I will cull any breeding animal that is not producing the personality that I want to promote!

Natural gait - When I put a saddle on a horse I want to know that it is going to be smooth and easy to ride. I do not want to have to work to keep a horse in gait! That would defeat the whole purpose of my breeding program. I am Ok with a horse that trots some in the field, but it better gait naturally under saddle!

Color - Colour does not make the horse, but it certainly sells it faster! So, yes, I will look for horses that produce interesting colour, but if the rest of my ideals are not met then I will not bring the horse home.

Cost - We try and keep our costs down and pass that on to our clients. Most people can not afford to spend 6 months wages on purchasing a horse. If you ask the moon you will find that very few people can pay for it!

Convenience - I am willing to travel to find the right horse for my breeding program. However, if I find two very comparable horses, I will probably buy the one closer to home so that I can keep my transportation costs down.

Speed of footfall and animation - I don't care about these one at all! As long as the horses gait is smooth and even. I am much more interested in producing a strong and enduring trail horse than a show horse with flying feet! Sure I have horses with a lot of animation, but that was not the reason that I bought them!