Gelding an older stallion

[FineStepFarm]

Hello, I am in the process of buying a stallion, he's 7, my intent was to breed my mares and possibly outside mares. Well I was reading all the posts on stallions, and it seems that I probably won't make any $$ on him because breeding outside mares is such a crapshoot.

So I think I want to geld him, I hate to segregate him from the other horses, and the screaming is getting on my nerves! My 19 year old daughter was bringing him in from the round pen and he got all excited when he was going to the barn and started to rear.

So my question is, how long will it be until the hormones leave his system?
Then can he be with the other horses? Can he ever be with geldings?
Tammi

[Pinto Paso]

Much will depend on
if he has already bred mares
what his "learned" behavior is as a stallion
his general temperament

Yes the "drive" or desire and ability to breed will diminish - often within 3 months but if he had a segregated life style, or lack of socialization as a stallion he may not ever evolve into a good herd horse.. If he is a possessive, assertive and/or aggressive horse as a stallion then this could carry over as a gelding... there is also a possibility that it is mostly the testosterone and that with gelding it will diminish greatly..

I have seen it work very well with older stallions and have seen it take many years for an older (6-8) stud to really integrate in to a herd.

[Carol Nelson]

I deleted my post as I just figured out that perhaps you're not the one who owns Capuchero???? Am I right or wrong?

[Pinto Paso]

Wrong person Carol..... Capuchero is still in California, getting ready to move to TN... Tammi moved to TN from Florida :D come on focus :lol:

[Carol Nelson]

Hey...Pinto Babe...save your insults for Helen...hehehe....
Yeah, I've been up all night... :roll:
But I got the state right... ;-)

[motorgypsy]

Stallions can be with other stallions and geldings. It's individual. But they do play rough so if you have a million dollar stallion you might want to stick to maybe a goat as a buddy rather than another horse.

We have three stallions and a gelding who live together. The oldest stallion is a breeding stallion but we have rules for breeding so he knows when the lady is there for more than a neighborly whinny. The gelding is the boss of the herd. He was gelded at age one but will still mount and "breed" a mare if she's willing. The older mares hate the gelding and wouldn't socialize with him so he took down three fences to get in with the stallion. The stallion took a big chunk out of his neck but he didn't care and now they are best buddies. The next stallion, a hormonal three year old colt, is the son of the breeding stallion obviously. He was put in with daddy at a little over a year in age. We took the gelding out and put him with our yearling filly just to keep from complicating things and daddy got along great with his boy. We put the three back together a few months later and they did fine. We added a three year old mini stallion to the group and he was a very bad boy and picked on the bigger boys until the oldest stallion literally picked him up and put him down and held him there until he stopped squirming. After that he stopped being so naughty. (He bit them on the legs - not hard - just annoying - and just picked on them and wouldn't quit so we were glad when Sultan finally put a stop to it.)

So how would I approach socializing a new stallion if I had the ones I have now? I'd put them in adjacent paddocks one at a time )after I was sure he didn't have any hidden viruses or anything) where they could nose each other and keep an eye on them. Some stallions and geldings just are very difficult to socialize. Others do just fine. When ours are separated they still play across the fence and it's obviously play, not war. And I'd make sure the girls are nowhere near them although once they are together they have a hierarchy and the boss of the male group will run the others back if a mare comes near - in season or not so there really is no problem after they are integrated into the herd.

There is a great I think MFT farm advertisement show on RFDTV that shows a stallion herd at their farm and how they behave when a mare in season is brought to the fence. All the stallions but a couple will move back just on a look from the boss stallion. Number two will stay fairly close until number 1 threatens to bite or kick. Then he moves away too. There are eve herds that have and "assistant" stallion (I bet a son of the head stallion) who is on occasion allowed to breed a mare. Pretty interesting.

A gelding is a stallion who can't reproduce. They still have the male behaviors toward the mares and they still play rough like boys and they will fight over mares if put in a mixed herd. But they are not all alike and some are much worse than others.

Also it takes time for them to settle into a new place. Our guys hollered a lot for the first couple of months at our new farm that is next door to a boarding barn on one side and one lot down from a boarding barn on the other side, but now the only one who still is pacing the line is our hormonal three year old colt. And he only does it occasionally. So your boy just may need time to adapt. Some people keep their stallions in with the pregnant mares and they are quite happy with them. But if your stallion has never been a herd stallion and you put him out with the mares and he has no manners, they will literally beat him to a pulp. He will learn how to treat a lady.

[Terry Wallace]

Don't do it if it is very HOT outside...do it in fall or cool weatherif you can.
Older stallions that are well endowed will need ligatures, the heat makes healing take longer and swelling get pretty bad.

I have gelded a few stallions over the age of ten. All went well.

After care counts a LOT...

[Pinto Paso]

And then there are stallions that will kill a gelding... so please make sure you know your horse!!!

we have 5 stallions - all but the most junior are breeding stallios. 1/2 have not had the chance to be raised here (purchased as adults)... some can get turn out tiem together. Others CAN NOT. Yet they stand side by side in half open air (light panel) stalls in the STALLION barn... as soon as a mare comes by (accidently) the whole atmosphere changes because they are jousting for a mares attention.

If you are willing to put up with the injuries (bites, kicks, blowing fences etc) then they will probably sort it out when one is determined as most dominant.. We dont like our stallions to fight for control and certainly cant afford to have our stallions injured.

[Laura S]

Yes, all stallions are individuals. The gelding I have now was a stud and used for breeding until he was 7. He is now 18, but he is the kindest horse I have ever seen with other horses. He has always been the herd leader around here, but he seems to accomplish that somehow in a very gentle manner. He has also been a great babysitter for my weanling, now a yearling. He gets a little frisky around my mare....and she is MEAN to him, but he just stays away and respects her space when she tells him to.

[motorgypsy]

I do want to make it clear that there are some stallions and geldings that are dangerous enough so that I would never attempt to integrate them. A thoroughbred gelding at one of our boarding barns broke through a fence to get to a thoroughbred stallion. He seriously injured the stallion and some time later the stallion went after him and in the process picked up two kids and threw them out of the pasture. Neither was seriously injured but both had a major bite. Just like our stallion picked up our obnoxious mini stallion. You don't just go and throw two strange horses together. The stallion might possibly be integrated into a male herd but not that gelding without some serious war. A male herd is a great solution though for an older stallion who really doesn't need to be gelded because he's so well behaved already. Gelding an older stallion can be dangerous. One who lived next door went blind from blood loss when an inexperienced vet cut him too short and the cord went up into his abdomen so just be sure to get a very experienced vet to geld an older stallion.

Another of our boarding barn owner's favorite mare had to be destroyed because another mare challenged her boss mare status and kicked her in the hock and broke it in several places as well as dislocating it. She had to be put down. So it's not just the boys who play rough. Our boss mare is big, tough and fast and woe be unto any mare who challenges her. And her two daughters are numbers 2 and 3 in the herd of 9 mares and they are also very tough and defend their status fiercely. You have to be really careful anytime you integrate a new horse into a herd because they will play for keeps if they don't like the newcomer.

[Linda Y]

I have 2 geldings that think they are still stallions. Desi was gelded as a 2 year old, never bred. Not sure about Bueno...he is very stallion like in manner and looks.
The two boys have worked it out among themselves and everyone gets along great. But at first, it was awful. They fought constantly, and Desi is one of those that will let you believe he took his licks, but will wait for the opportunity to ambush.
Now, if I bring another gelding in, they will double team and gang up on the newcomer. The last 2 geldings I have gotten also had strong stallion tendancies, which I didn't know until they got here and it was very unpleasant until I found them new homes.
You just never know how a horse is going to be until after it is gelded.