Natural Paso Fino Gait

[Fuego]

My intent of this thread is not to define natural gait in the Paso Fino breed, but to ask people to offer their own personal perspective of what natural gait is to them.
Perhaps arguements happen on this point because of different definitions of natural gait in the Paso Fino.

For me, seeing the pf gait at liberty or in hand is great, but not paramount.
But when I'm in the saddle and I ask for the next gear beyond a walk, I EXPECT the pf gait. Regardless if the horse is collected, on a loose rein, or ridden at liberty, if the horse performs the pf gait when asked to go faster, then it is naturally gaited.
If a horse HAS to be trained and manipulated to perform the pf gait because it would perform a gait other then the pf gait if given it's own choice, is not a naturally paso fino gaited Paso Fino.

Not to say the 'not naturally' pf gaited horse performs the pf gait in an inferior manner to a naturally pf gaited horse,just that it is not naturally pf gaited.

With other gaited breeds, I've had to "learn "how to ride them to get the desired gait from the horses. I love being able to put a newbie on a naturally gaited Paso Fino. All they have to do is sit there and enjoy the ride, they don't have to 'work' to acheive the 'paso smile'.

I have limited experience with other gaited breeds, but none of them have had the natural correct gait for their breed like I've experienced in the Paso Fino.

Not saying I am correct, but this is how natural gait is defined in my mind.
And since Paso Finos are readily available that will pf gait naturally, I see no reason to settle for less.
Not to say a 'not naturally" pf gaited PF can't be a superior riding/performance horse, but I do feel nautal pf gait should be a requirement for breeding stock.

Again, not the gospel, just my perspective on natural gait in the Paso Fino horses of the U.S.

I promise not to argue or disagree with anyone elses veiw or opinions on this topic. ( If ... I ... can do that, EVERYBODY should be able to do the same :lol: )

[Kerry W]

I agree with you Mitch, but I think we have to remember that there are many aspects of the horse, that make it a "Paso Fino". Gait is but one element. Should we not breed to a horse that only has a so so gait, if it has an abundance of the rest of the qualities that make an outstanding example of our breed? Brio, temperament, beauty, conformation. I think we have to be careful not to throw the baby out with the bath water. I think it's our nature to try to simplify things to the smallest common denominator, but I don't think you can do that and be successful, when it comes to breeding a great Paso Fino. Gait is paramount, but it's only one part of the package...like buying a set of great performance tires. If we put them on an old Buick station wagon...it's kind of a waste. ;-)

[ErinC]

I think it is
"gait is in the eye of the beholder"
we all know that they gait much differant.
no 2 gait the same.
there are MANY aspects to the gait.... and what gait YOU want might not be that gait someone else wants. ;-)

I like my relaxed ride, and my pulled in ride.
but I never force something, just help encourage it to come out.

it also depends on the horse, Kims Horse - her stallion here, he gaits, he just gaits, at liberty, on the lead to go from pasture to pasture, on the trails and in the ring.
no need to pull in for PF gait with him, its just there.
I guess you COULD pull in with him and get fino!
but why?
he is prefect just the way he is!


to me... natural gait in the Paso Fino:::

is just that, let the horse be natural--- when I am out trail riding, and I ask for more then a walk,,,, what my paso gives me,
is
natural gait ---- it might not be perfect, it might not be smooth , but what he is doing for him is his Natural gait.... !

[PLEASURE PASOFINO]

DELETED

[Fuego]

I agree 100% Kerry.

Though this topic is singling out one Paso Fino trait, by no means do I intend to insinuate that gait is the only trait that makes a Paso Fino or it is the only trait that matters.
I agree a Paso Fino is many things, but singling out one specific trait to discuss doesn't negate the importance of all the other traits that make a Paso Fino a Paso Fino.

Thank you for bringing up that point early in the thread ;-)

"Natural gait" appeared in another thread, and this is what prompted my post.

[Kerry W]

I fully understand. I think it's one of the best parts of the breed...that there are so many different kinds of paso fino, that remain true to the breed type. That way...no matter what you love, there is one out there for just about everyone. :D

[Heidi]

Natural is just that: natural. If you have to train or manipulate to get it...it isn't natural.

Personally, I feel there are plenty of horses with good brio, correct conformation, easy temperament AND natural gait to breed to.
Why breed sub-standard horses to achieve one trait when with a little searching, you can have the whole package? Of this, certainly gait is only one part...but it IS what the breed is known and named for. ;-) If a horse doesn't gait naturally and must be manipulated into gait, I would not breed it as I feel it would only propagate the problem and increase the lack of correct/natural gait down the genetic line.

[Kerry W]

Define "sub standard". If it gaits under saddle (with no effort), but doesn't always gait in the pasture, or (heaven forbid) moves diagonally in the pasture, is that substandard?

[Heidi]

Substandard in my definition does not apply to horses who do/don't gait in pasture, so long as they will gait naturally and smoothly under saddle when asked.
By substandard, I mean poor conformation faults that should not be passed on; super long backs, ewe necks, weak haunches, straight shoulders, poor leg construction...basic conformation.

[Jasfino]

Natural is just that: natural ....so true Heidi...but...



If you have to train or manipulate to get it...it isn't natural

Good training will enhance the horses ability to perform. Horses like any other athlete ...should have the proper training in order to perform their to their highest potential... :D

[Abejita]

we must also take into account the rider..
My older mare (Abejita's mother) is one that I will pull out of the stall , snap 2 leads on her halter, jump ( ok climb ungracefully) on her bareback and she just gaits up and down the aisle.I had a 'newer' but not totally green paso rider here once and we were both riding her..taca taca taca..she was going on about how smooth she was..so Mr Trainer got on her..I honestly dont know for sure WHAT he was doing , I think trying to 'collect her up " and all she would do for him was trot..PURE trot..I kept saying "throw the reins away, throw the reins away"..He didnt -got off of her and basically said she dont gait.We got right back on and as he walked away made he go taca taca again..
I think we do some disservice If we dont admit that different styles of riding can affect even the best naturally gaited horse..

[ErinC]

2 very good points.

1)style of riding,
and
2)training will enhance the horses ability to perform.

this is very true, I have seen it time and time again!

[CarolU]

Well, I want a horse that gaits when I ask it to go. Period. Gaiting at liberty is not a requirement, but it certainly shows natural ability.

I went through a lot of work to get Rosie to gait, and I don't think you should have to do that. I had help from Vicki, Johnny and Jamie to supple her, bring her rear end under her, and get her into gait. But your average owner doesn't have gait "experts" available. Once she figured out she can gait, she does most of the time, but it took a LOT of work to get there. Believe me, I was about ready to resign myself to a trotting horse, when 'suddenly' she took off in gait. I was not about to be be mean, push, pull, or drive her onto the bit to make her gait. She almost had a life of a very smooth trotter.

All my others, you get on and they gait. Not to say they always stay in gait. Santiago goes pacey when he's tired, Diablo has to take catch-up steps on his rear end to stay in corto. Zar will trot when you throw the reins away. They're all different. BUT, I didn't have to have ANY help, work, or special equipment getting them to gait in the first place.

Bien is a little different, she came to me a professionally trained Performance horse. You pick the reins up she starts to gait, she pushes until she's on the bit, you pull back she gaits faster, you have to pull REALLY hard to get her to stop. She stands when you drop the reins. She had no flat walk at all. I can't take her on trails without a flat walk and I'm sure she's tired for arena work. A few weeks ago I took her bridle off, rode her with a rope halter. WaaLaa, flat walk, easy corto on a loose rein, and BRAKES. I'm a happy camper, and so is she to finally be allowed out of the arena.

[Boyd R]

Fuego I agree with you. But I prefer to call it a Paso Fino that prefers to be in proper PF gait rather than call it naturally gaited. Otherwise it sounds like not all Paso Finos are natural and have to be trained or manipulated. And granted I assume there are those that do have to be. But a horse that does not prefer to move in proper PF gait is no less naturally gaited.
To me naturally means built to perform the gait. Which all purebred Paso should be. Granted you have Darwins theory of a regect from time to time.
And I truelly beleive that we hurt the breed by saying a horse that does not prefer to move in proper PF gait is not naturally gaited.

[Heidi]

Natural is just that: natural ....so true Heidi...but...
If you have to train or manipulate to get it...it isn't natural
Good training will enhance the horses ability to perform. Horses like any other athlete ...should have the proper training in order to perform their to their highest potential... :D
Very good point, but I suspect that my comment about 'training for gait' was geared more to mean 'train a horse that naturally wants to trocha to pf gait'. These horses that prefer to trocha and not pf gait, should not be adding to the pf gene pool to muddy the gait.

[Jasfino]

If a horse HAS to be trained and manipulated to perform the pf gait because it would perform a gait other then the pf gait if given it's own choice, is not a naturally paso fino gaited Paso Fino.

:D In fact it probably is a naturally gaited paso fino...doing a gait that you didnt expect..

I kind of think of horses like dancers. Some days they could be slightly out of step...not in practice.. tired...feeling bad... stressed out.. but certainly not perfect everytime..just like the humans that ride them... ;-)

[sporthorse]

I also agree with everyone. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder and pretty is as pretty does. however= disclaimer; people have differant standards and some would not recognize gait if they went to annual continuing education seminars put on by professionals seminar trained and credentialled to the max and were watching films all day. In the old days the judges actually rode the horses in work offs to determine the finest of nuances in the differance between two or more champs that tells me there is increments beyond eye and opinions that must be felt.I concur that one who is pleased with the eveness after being exposed to smooth trotting horses and coming to our breed would be thrilled, and then those from other gaited breeds that are lumersome rather than quick or indescernably moving with daisey cutting action would love "natural" naturally .Also then the added gaits outside paso fino standards could also be naturally smooth and still be natural to our breed, also smooth and to some discernablely undetectably non standard. It is that what you feel as smooth is what counts even if judges deem other wise. And there are those that say "any" horse can gait once the weaknesses are trained out of them, would love to see that. I also believe in paranormal phenomena.

[Heidi]

Pffft! Then why bother with shows or a breed organization that defines they want an evenly spaced gait? If the horse is smooth, that is all I care about.

[motorgypsy]

The breed organization sets standards that a group of people agree personify the breed. Others who join the organization are free to submit proposals changing these standards until in general those who are members of the organization are reasonably satisfied with the standards. Judges are then trained to look for these standards and to quantify the deviation from the standards and if they don't do this well then shows shouldn't hire them.

But as far as the individual owner of a horse of any breed - it's totally up to them what they like, what they buy and what they breed for. And if they come up with something slightly different that everyone likes better, the standards will change. This is how the fino/fino got into the breed. People just love to see the faster and faster speeds and would buy the fino/fino horses so others started trying to breed them. The market rules. People breed what sells.

I'm all for smooth and even but I don't throw out "pretty" either !! ;-) ;-)

[Jasfino]

I also believe in paranormal phenomena.


:bad bannana You know better than that!! There are no such thing as ghosts!!

[Jasfino]

This link explains alot... It's one of my favorites..

http://www.gaitedranchhorses.com/oldpfbloodlines.htm