paso training tack (tail keeper)

[mrhappypants]

hi, where can i find a tail keeper? do they work well for collecting the rear end etc? are they expensive? any help will be appreciated.

[Pasogirlz]

Are you talking about a "butt or rearend collecter". I think they go by a few names in spanish too.
You can buy them off casa dosa's site I think. They usually run about $60/$80 bucks.
Some ppl like them and some don't. Just depends. Personally I think it depends on the horse.

[mrhappypants]

i got the paso handbook II and she called it a tail keeper, i havent seen them on casa dosa?

[Cindy]

They are not for collecting the horse. They are for keeping the tail from swishing.

[ErinC]

o I need one too,
the more I get my boy into "brio" the more he holds his tail like an Arab.

[Pasogirlz]

They are not for collecting the horse. They are for keeping the tail from swishing.

I know, but I have seen them called "collecters" on sales websites. I thought maybe that is why he can't find it.

[mrhappypants]

paso handbook II said it was to help collect them in the back also, so they dont get strung out and tightens gait up?

[Pasogirlz]

paso handbook II said it was to help collect them in the back also, so they dont get strung out and tightens gait up?

Some trainers believe this and some don't. Again, I think it depends on the horse. What works for some might not work for others.

[mrhappypants]

so are they to hold the tail from swishing(which i thought was a attitude problem? or does it or can it work to collect them in the back? is there anything negative that it can cause to try it on a young horse in training? lunging etc?

[Pasogirlz]

It depends what trainer you ask. Some ppl say they are only for keeping the horse from tail swishing. But some trainers believe it also helps w/the collection.
I used it on my gelding and it helped a lot w/his hind end collection and keeping him from getting strung out. But it does not help on every horse out there. And it takes time, it is not an overnight thing. It's more gradual.

A lot of trainers will call it a "skirt" which they tie the tail to it keep them from swishing. It is a little less bulky than the other one but I think basically is for the same things. I'm sure the trainers will correct me where I am wrong. I am only repeating what I have heard myself from asking. ;-)

[mrhappypants]

i have understood tail swishing to be a attitude problem? i thought it meant the horse isnt happy? so holding the tail down makes them happy again? lol

[Pasogirlz]

LOL. Good point. ;-)
My horse is a tail swisher. :oops: It just seems part of his personality. He seems to hold a lot of resentment about past experiences. He is the type that anytime he is asked to work he has to let you know about it. :roll: I don't really think it matters if his tail is tied, he will always do it (or want to do it). JMHO. I think it is more habit now than him really hating his job.

[PattiB]

This is Casa Dosa's http://casadosa.com/Scripts/prodList.asp?idCategory=28 They call it a skirt also called a retranca. Holding their tail down won't make them happy, it just keeps them from making a habit of swishing at every little thing you ask them to do that they don't like. It will make some horses tuck their rearends but others just ignore it.

[Cindy]

It will make them get under more at first. Like the first day as they are not used to it. After they are used to it it does not change the way they move or collect. Lori, if you found that your horse got better over time, it was most likely becuause he was more mature, had more work, was more finished, you were working him properly, etc. If he did not get better as all this happened, that would be unusual. The retranca had nothng to do with it.

mrhappypants, not going to ask how you arived at that name for yourself. Don't believe everything you read in books. And, yes, horses swish the tail when they are unhappy. They also swish at flys and some swish when you use leg on them and some just like to swish for not much reason at all. For whatever reason that they swish, it can become a habit. They are penalized in the show ring for swishing the tail so it is not a habit that we like them to adapt. When you are teaching horses, they are not always happy to learn everything that you are teaching them.

[Terry Wallace]

"Rear-end collector"...its a mis-nomer. Collection comes from the lumbar-sacral joint of the horse (the back) it takes time to condition to get it and it takes steady training to keep it.

Some feel it is just another short-cut to real training, and it is true that the first time you put it on, the horse may hump its back, but that is not true collection. You can get the same effect by tying the tail with a string on each side to each side of your saddle skirt.

True collection starts from ground work first, and proceeds to saddle work. There really are no short-cuts.

Tying tails is to stop ANY swishing, as swishing can cost you points/placement. Its to try and get the horse not to swish...no matter what.

[PASOFAN]

pasogirlz borrowed me one for chico. I used it as a desentisizing tool, he also tucked his butt very nicely and gaited better.. I plan to buy one someday when I ahve some extra $$..

here is a pic of the one PasoGirlz let me use...:

http://www.2hottotrot.com/data/500/BUTT_COLLECTOR2.JPG

I really liked it, chico didnt though, he has a issue of things on his butt, that is why I was usin it.. :D

[Cindy]

Pasofan, if you use it again, loosen it up a bit. It is too tight. Should fit very loosely or it will rub the horse. Just tight enough so that it stays in place and does not come off the side when the horse moves.

[Pasogirlz]

Pasofan, if you use it again, loosen it up a bit. It is too tight. Should fit very loosely or it will rub the horse. Just tight enough so that it stays in place and does not come off the side when the horse moves.

That's what I told her when she sent me the pix the first time. She wasn't sure how they were supposed to fit (since they don't see that type of tack being used around here area). But she got it figured out after that. ;-)

[Brigitte]

i have understood tail swishing to be a attitude problem? i thought it meant the horse isnt happy? so holding the tail down makes them happy again? lol

They don't allow tail swishing in shows. 6 times and you're out. They have this rule because mostly the horse will swish because it's annoyed or unhappy so they penalize that since the horse is supposed to be willing to work. Holding the tail down or tieing it to the side are supposed to help with not swishing anymore. because supposedly the horse will get used to not being able to move his tail and therefor will stop.

[PASOFAN]

Yep, cindy I know... Figured taht out after a few tries, these were just the pic I had of it... Pretty neat thing I thought...