Color question

[Pam M]

Can a dun with distinct barring and primitive markings gray? How can I tell? I have a 6 month old filly, definite dun, striping on legs, shoulder markings, the works - but she has a lot of white hairs in her face. She doesn't have gray eyelashes or any gray on her ears and no other sign of gray but she does have a gray mama. The only white hairs are on her face - nowhere else - but there's a lot of them. Her daddy is Wind Dancer, who's a mahogany dun. I can't post a photo because I don't have a good, recent one and even if I did, I don't know how to post one. My vet says duns don't gray. I don't think that's true, is it?

[motorgypsy]

grey is dominant and masks all colors and dilutions including dun so yes they'll grey. You have at least a 50% chance for a grey baby if one parent is grey. Usually you can tell a grey when they are born because they'll have a few very white hairs at the top of the tail. Arwen didn't have any white on her face for more than two years but her tail is almost pure white now at 3 1/2 and she does have ugly white splotches all over her face. Some grey early and others take 15 years to more to go white. It will help if you find out at what age the mom went grey.

[GeorgeGuns]

Yes. Dun and grey are two different genes that don't affect eachother, so a horse with both will be base color ___ dun and will grey.

Horses greying patterns vary a little. Some get real white in the face first before telltale hairs are blatant elsewhere, some get greyer first at the ends of their tails, or get a smattering in the mane or on the ears. Some keep dark legs for a long time, some get pretty grey there quickly. Some white out by the time they are 3 (not so common) or some take years and years to go through their greying stages.

[pasofantasy]

I wouldn't judge by when a parent went grey. I had one that didn't go grey for years, but the offspring greyed faster. In fact, a daughter was registered as a grey before 6 months.

[Pam M]

I didn't think she would gray because when she was born she had no white anywhere except for one white sock. Not on tail or ears or around eyes. She still has no white hairs anywhere except on her face. Her mother started graying young - around 2 y.o. She's 5 now and is dapple gray but lightening up fast. Guess we'll have to wait and see!

[Terry Wallace]

Yep..you cannot go with the mare's time frame. Your filly got one gray gene. Grays start to go gray on both ends...face & base of tail first... they can take years & years to get white...

It seems like homozygous grays "gray out faster" than heterozygous grays...

When your filly was born.... was she born "brilliant"...which means ...did she already LOOK like a dun, with dark legs...or were her legs light colored ...called "fawn legs" in where she had to shed out to dark legs? Do you remember? Or have a photo you could post of her under a week old? Foals born brilliant (from at least one gray parent) ... have a 90% chance of going gray. Foals born "fawn legged" with a silvery cast to their coat..have a 90% chance of staying a solid color.

[paintedhorizon]

Yep, Stella's mare Rita is a dun going gray.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y65/jklawitter/Paso%20Fino/100_5408.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y65/jklawitter/Paso%20Fino/siggiepic.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y65/jklawitter/Paso%20Fino/100_5217.jpg

[Pam M]

Terry, she was not born brilliant. She had fawn colored legs that have since turned black with primitive markings. Her mane, tail and dun stripe were red at birth and they are in the process of turning black. Her coat overall has darkened considerably but some of that can be attributed to winter coat also. So I guess she has a 90% chance of staying dun. She just has weird white hairs in her face!

[Terry Wallace]

Do you have a foal pic?

Have you taken her tail, and gone to the end of the tail bone, parted the hairs back, and do you see light hair in there?

Duns don't normally have any white hairs on the face... it is the first place gray gene will begin to express (Head and tail)....

Doesn't mean she couldn't have some... but I suspect she will gray, by your description.... time will tell...is the dam heterozygous gray (Had only one gray parent)?

[motorgypsy]

Of course exceptions to every rule. Our non grey dun has a Profeta son, heterozygous grey, who was silvery snow white at five. A friend has a heterozygous grey filly who is nearly white at age one - just a hint of the red she was born as. Arwen, a 222 grandaughter, heterozygous grey, is nearly four and has some grey but had no grey on her face at all for two years, none at birth, was born nearly black - kindof ebony brown - and now has a white tail and the white splotches on the face finally. Very ugly phase by the way. The point being - they're gonna do what they're gonna do. I do wonder if there are some food supplements that hasten or delay greying like the ones that enhance chestnut (paprika for one) and black (I've been told sage will do it but black as night sp? does work) Terry what do you think??

[Terry Wallace]

I can't say..I've never tried color-specific feedstuffs..I have used coat-builder supplements, but honestly..think I get about the same results keeping horses out of the sun! This high altitude sun really bleaches coats here...

Notes:
Quickest to gray horses I've worked with...Arabs...whether they were HZ or HT gray.

Takes a bit longer to gray...Andalusians...lots of HZ gray there. But takes at least till six to go "white"...usually by ten years or more to get white body. Of course they are born brilliant black or brilliant brown most of the time...

[motorgypsy]

Pascale posted the stuff they feed to keep the lemurs red and they use shrimp to keep the flamingos pink but don't know about anything that will hasten the greying process. I wish I did. At this point I'm gonna use a black magic marker on Arwen until her face is totally grey. She looks like she has a fungus or something!