PPR lovers - take heart!

[SandyMM]

At the last several shows I have attended, I have put out assorted literature/magazines etc. that showcase the type bloodlines I prefer - one of which is PPR, of course!

It is hard to describe the people who come by my booth, see the PPR info, and then strike up a conversation about the PPRs. They are both exhibitors and spectators (who own, but don't show, Pasos). Almost to a person, they start out in a low voice - almost as if the PPR interest is something they think they shouldn't admit to, and are almost relieved to know that there are other PPR-lovers too! Sometimes, their recollections of PPRs they owned in the past are almost wistful, and I have yet to hear of one person saying they ever regretted owning a PPR. Some said they sold because the PPR bloodlines weren't currently 'fashionable' in the show ring, yet they aren't really happy with their show horses gaits and the training that is required to get/keep them in gait. They don't see a future for the PPR in PFHA's show ring. They do express a concern that in the not-so-distant future the PFHA show horse will no longer do the paso fino gait naturally, nor be expected to... just telling you what they're telling me...

All this actually bodes well for the PPR Paso who is still known for its soft, smooth ride and unforced gait. If you have a PPR mare, seek out the best PPR stallion you can find and help regenerate this fast-disappearing breed. The market_is_ turning the corner and people _are_ longing for the special gait that PPRs claim as their birthright.

[Pasogirlz]

ShowTime and I have been discussing covering more PPR stuff. So please help us by telling us what you would like to see covered about these special horses.

What topics would make good reading?

What farms would you like to see spotlighted?

What shows should be covered?

[Candice Burger]

Someone with the moxie "should" write an aritcle the very clearly distinguishes the difference between Colombian and Puerto Rican horses. It's more than "smooth" gait, which is too relative.

There's the difference in phenotype, body build, croup, tail set, head, etc.

There is the difference in how the horse moves while in gait.

Just a dream of mine.

I was telling a friend about the differences and he never understood until he bought a PPR mare several years ago.

More people should learn what the true, consistent differences are and learn how to look for them.

I digress but someone should also write an aritcle to discusses the differing expressions of paso gait. Not fino, corto, largo, but about paddling and how some horse move like El Fleco. Many have only seen the Resorte IV crosses and have NO idea that there are other phenotypes of paso gait out there.

[SandyMM]

I'm wondering if there is anyone in PR who could put us in touch with the PR Dept of Agriculture for an update on the status/numbers of registered PPRs in the world today.

Remember that 'born in PR' or 'from PR' do not necessarily make a Paso PPR... As far as I know there is only one registry that maintains itself as PPR. Most, if not all, of the other registries were mixed with non-PPR bloodlines a while back.

It is _quite_ amazing to hear of the resurgence of interest in the PPR Paso...

Also, there is/was a new magazine coming out as of tlast August called 'Son de Aquí' - verry loosely translated... 'They are of/from here'

I plan to be at the PFHA/PPR show in August in Colombia, SC, and hope that the magazine representatives will be there again... I wish I had gotten my subscription then!

[Pasogirlz]

Candice...care to take on that article? I would if I was given the information, but I am so new, I feel someone who has a bit more knowledge in this area could do a better job.

[ErinC]

I pull my hair out trying to tell people, you have seen me ask a million times for info to give people...
I know why I like them, but I can not argue it ! I am not good at that...
((I have a 100% Col, horse and I love his ride too. ))
but UNLTILL you ride and take one out on a trail, you will NEVER KNOW, is what I tell people now!

[Pasogirlz]

I agree, w/o the ride, words are useless. But it would still be nice to have the differences organized into a nice article for people who are new to the breed and and have no idea what the differences might me. I know I sure didn't when I first got pasos.
*I was like...what difference does it REALLY make? :roll:

[cheryl w]

I think we spend too much time trying to compare Col to PPR and identify the differences. Maybe we should just focus on PPR for what it is and glorify/discuss/recognize those attributes. We loose sight of the point of learning about ppr when it evolves into a "who is better" disscussion...

Just my humble opinion :)

[ErinC]

Cheryl ,
I have got to get up there and ride with you, how about and over nighter in Aug. ?

[cheryl w]

Erin
I would love that! I have lots of room. Three of my pprs are well trained and very trail worthy. The other three are 3,2 and weanling...

I should offer that anyone who wants to try the breed and lives in this area is welcome to "test drive" my horses.

Let me know what timing looks good for you.

Sandy and Lori, maybe it would be a good idea for all to post what farms have ppr and in what city,state so anyone thinking of buying one, would know where they could go in their area..just a thought.

I think there are a lot of ppr's tucked away in various parts of the US, I would like to know where they are as well.

[Pasogirlz]

Perhaps I should separate them in the classifieds? What do you think?

A list of farms with PPR horses would be great. Lets get started. :D

[ErinC]

I will look on the cal. and see what works but I am thinking I would love to come up and spend the night before school starts back up, you are only 3 hrs away from me. (thats mapquest, so I am sure it is less.
I brought my daughter to camp the other day ext 23 off 93 it was 2 1/2 hrs....

[cheryl w]

I think that is a good idea to seperate the classified.

It would be so interesting to know where these horses are by having a list of the farms or even know about people who have ONE tucked away that they love.

I also am curious to know who has good ppr breeding stallions and let others know that as well.

[Candice Burger]

I disagree, TOO MUCH TIME is spent arguing about who is the "smoothest" not about the true phenotypical differences in conformation and the way the gait is expressed. There ARE differences that neither strain is capable of providing. That is what makes each as desireable as the other.

"Smooth" is a relative term. And it should not be a comparison at ALL, but a true guide about how to tell PPR from COL when the way of going is SIMILAR. There are high action PPRs too.

I wish I had a tape of the MUNDIAL competition when Don Coqui placed third in fino stallions. I bet that few touting PPR gait would have known he was PPR until the rider grabbed a PR flag or not even then because so many horses in PR are mixed now. That is what I am talking about. How to distinguish traits that make the horse unique.

[cheryl w]

Candice
If what you are saying is neither is better than the other..just different. I wholeheartedly agree with that point of view.

But sadly, so many discussions involving ppr and col end up being the "who is better" perspective, especially in these forums. My point was to be able to avoid that so that we could get to a higher level disscussion on the attributes of ppr in isolation of Col.

Thanks for the perspective. Cheryl

[Pasogirlz]

I disagree, TOO MUCH TIME is spent arguing about who is the "smoothest" not about the true phenotypical differences in conformation and the way the gait is expressed. There ARE differences that neither strain is capable of providing. That is what makes each as desireable as the other.

"Smooth" is a relative term. And it should not be a comparison at ALL, but a true guide about how to tell PPR from COL when the way of going is SIMILAR. There are high action PPRs too.

I wish I had a tape of the MUNDIAL competition when Don Coqui placed third in fino stallions. I bet that few touting PPR gait would have known he was PPR until the rider grabbed a PR flag or not even then because so many horses in PR are mixed now. That is what I am talking about. How to distinguish traits that make the horse unique.

I agree with this. We need a clear guide to help identify the horses. The article should not be negative in anyway towards either PR or Col, but help the new people be more educated about what to look for in a quality PPR horse. I personally have a preference of Col. horses, but until I understood the differences, I could not identify one from the other. It's all about preferences (the Col. vs PPR) and until you understand the differences, you may not know which you prefer. 8-)

[SandyMM]

Perhaps I should separate them in the classifieds? What do you think?

I think that would be a terrific idea! And any one who knows or meets someone with a PPR - be sure to let them know about this BB - last count I heard 3000 +/_ in the world with 600-800 in the U.S. That's a very tiny gene pool....

[SandyMM]

true phenotypical differences in conformation and the way the gait is expressed.

So - describe your impressions of these differences....

I know when the COlombian Pasos arrived they were generally larger and had more refined heads than the PPRs. They also had - generally - a flashier way of going - more up front action.... However, that is not to say that PPRs couldn't 'pick'em up and put'em down'... In this old pic of Antares - you can see he was not necessarily a daisy clipper - although he was _extremely_ smooth at any speed. And - he was a Kofresi son.... can't get any more PPR than that!

http://www.arrowheadpasofinos.com/Antaresextension.jpeg

[Pasogirlz]

Sandy- Done! I moved your colt into that catagory...Congrats, you're the first one in there. I left Emi where he was.

[ErinC]

WHen you say PURE are we talking 100% PR...

Just want to CLEAR that up.

I know one of mine has lots of PR in him, and Aprils new one does too, but not sure what the % is.
I think Arpils is 3/4
http://www.pasoregistry.com/db/Tree.asp?ID=113642
not sure what this one is, my new guy
http://www.pasoregistry.com/db/Tree.asp?ID=112161
I have NOT been on a PURE PR Paso...
looking forward to it!!!

[Kerry W]

Coleta is 3/4 PR. Erin, Pillo is an American blend...you have to go back at least 5 generations to separate the nationalities...so hang it up! :lol: If I get a minute, I'll see if I can figure it out. His pedigree is up there, Brenda keeps hers up to the minute...not sure how she does that...wonder if she's got pictures of Dave or what? :twisted:

http://www.pasoregistry.com/db/Tree.asp?ID=112161

[Kerry W]

Okay...if I did it right...you've got a 36/58 % PR pedigree on Pillo. So many lines!!!!! :shock: I had to go back 6 generations to end the mixes. Since Sandy's the teacher and all...she can go back and check my sipherin'! ;-)

[ErinC]

OMG, and that mean what in plan english?

:shock: :shock:

[Kerry W]

That means he's a blend of bloodlines...just enjoy! :D Maybe we could market them as "hybrids"? If you go back 6 generations in his pedigree, you can find Pure PR and Pure Colombian horses. From the 5th generation forward, you have some mixed bloodlines. None of it really means much to the horses...they can't read. :lol:

[SandyMM]

Sandy- Done! I moved your colt into that catagory

That's terrific - and I am honored... but Emi's colt is only 3/4 PR.... There's that 1/4 Coral LaCE - NOT that I'm complaining... I need to get my 100% PPR yearling filly into that category though... :-)

[Pasogirlz]

lol. well, I figured he sell better in the PR section.
:D

[Candice Burger]

Well, if it's in an article written in a factual manner, ya'll can debate away after it's published. I see no reason why the word "smooth" should even be mentioned-JMO. After all we are talking about pasos.

I like both strains and see the beauty in both types. And there are sub-types in both strains.

Again, it's an idea and doesn't have to be done.

[SandyMM]

I see no reason why the word "smooth" should even be mentioned-JMO. After all we are talking about pasos.

Well - that's the 'dirty little secret' - there are less smooth Pasos - in my opinion - now than there were in previous times... It is no longer a guarantee that Paso = smooth ride - automatically....

I must perfect my patented 'Jiggle-Meter' before the next show...! :lol:

[Pasogirlz]

Well my jiggle meters works pretty good and are never wrong. 8-) lol
*I hate to say this, but it's ture... "my girls" are the best indication of how smooth my ride is. It's how I judge the quality of gait underneath me. They don't lie. :shock:

[motorgypsy]

Yes we'd like a PPR article. There is a very difinitive Colombian article. A difinitive PPR article would be extremely helpful. If you read the Colombian article you will notice that there are also several different Colombian types depending on what part of Colombia the variety originated in. Info on the different PPR types would be so useful. We LOVE our PPR mare but our pure Colombians are smooth as silk and grogeous also so it's not a matter of comparison, it's matter of information. A PPR article also will let those shopping for a PPR to eliminate the ones who don't meet the characteristics that the PPR should have. We've ridden several PPR's that were for sale and they were not good examples of the paso fino. Not particularly smooth and no largo at all. There are poor examples of all breeds and the more knowledge we all have the less likely we are to buy or breed the poor ones in our breed.

[cheryl w]

kyle S

Your post was very well said.

I like were you say "it is not a matter of comparison, it is a matter of information"

As you note it is equally important to understand the ppr standards within the pure ppr breed so a potential buyer understands the breed standards in isolation from a Columbian comparison.




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[GeorgeGuns]

I sure miss my Katy (Arcadia de Azul). She was the sweetest and loveliest horse, smooth and attentive, just a pure joy. I don't know if its because she was PPR or just because...

One day I would like to be able to get a PPR mare again, not to fill Katy's shoes, but she will be the yardstick I measure with.

[April D]

Putting aside the "ride" aspect, I have never been around any horse, any breed, as sweet and easy going as Coleta! The temperment is extremely appealing! Have you all found this to be "the norm"? Not sure if it is coming from her PPR side, or from what I understand, was a hall mark of Coral LaCe?

[cheryl w]

I too love the intelligence and temperament of the ppr as well as the gait.
all of mine have friendly, inquisitive, intelligent personalities and love their "2-leggers" They are characters and joys to be around. I have not been around a ppr who doesnt have these traits. When you throw in the smooth ride, this is a nice combination of traits!

[SandyMM]

from her PPR side, or from what I understand, was a hall mark of Coral LaCe
The PPR side has Poquito Senor - a good disposition there - also, I learned recently - excellent recovery rates when it comes to endurance activities!

And yes it definitely would be related to the Coral LaCE influence..

[Carol Nelson]

Can someone tell me if my gelding, Nevare Mimbrera, is Pure Puerto Rican? He certainly is an exceptional horse...I am hoping my new mare is as exceptional.
Here's his pedigree off of Paso Registry:

http://pasoregistry.com/db/Tree.asp?ID=98101

His PFHA no. is 30204

[kennyg]

mostly Puerto Rican except for sire's dam. She is Colombian.