Turabo

[cristy]

Turabo was imported by Dr. Mays. He sent him to Louie Amador for training, he sent him back telling Dr. Mays to Geld him. Then he sent him to Raven Briggs. He said Turabo would go through the eye of a needle to get you off his back. He was sold to Zona Butler and Elizabeth Layman. Zona said you could ride him for about half an hour before he started being bad, come to find out he had a sebacous cyst on his withers, right where the saddle set. (go figure, I would be bad too!) She had the cyst removed and he was much better! He DID NOT kill anyone here or in Puerto Rico. It was said that he could not be shown, he was reserve International Grand Champion bella forma at the PR show in SC in 1995, 6 months before the barn fire that killed him. He was good for Zona he respected her and she could do anything with him. Like so many of these horses he was just misunderstood and was abused for it, and ended up with a bad rap.

His great legacy lives on in the offspring that he left us with. He passed on his beauty, stamina, pure natural gait, and a sweet loving disposition to every baby he put on the ground. It has also been tried and proven that his offspring linebred produce phenomenal results!
http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q310/cristy5513/zonapics307.jpg
http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q310/cristy5513/zonapics301.jpg
http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q310/cristy5513/zonapics303.jpg

[Carol Nelson]

Wow...beautiful animal! But what a sad ending... :(

[Terry Wallace]

here is a great-grandson of Turabo..... Darius that Deb Deckert now owns...notice the resemblence?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v101/twobarwpaso/DariusheadWEB.jpg

[JennLM]

We just got a grandson of his last week. Looks very close to his grandad and sire. Turabo sure was pretty.

[Linda Y]

The hair on that boy! And look at the size of his hooves. Substance, lots of substance. And more Volare. *sigh*

[PASOFAN]

WOW, a dapple bay, just LOVE that!! Interesting story about the cysts! Glad someone found out before he was passed on again..

[GeorgeGuns]

Wow, thanks for posting those! LOL - I wonder if Zona told me he was a "killer" to make sure I didn't get complacent around him? (Her barn was the first time I had really close contact with stallions, and Al was the first stallion I ever rode.)
Its those shoulders .. so unique, so manly... *sigh*

[cristy]

Coreen I am sure it was a better safe than sorry situation. Any horse that has been abused (imo) always has the potential to lose his trust for a moment and react to something before thinking about it, in which situations if you let your guard down you could be hurt. I have a Capuchino son who was badly abused and when he came here I was told that he would BITE and I mean need stitches bite. He has been nothing but sweet to me but I still tell newcomers he is very mean just so they do not bother him. ;-)

[Terry Wallace]

Not to offend and just an observation. I don't like his looks at all.
His head is huge, his body is not balanced his confo is..... well, !

What was his key to fame? Was he extremely well gaited? I had a horse that Turabo was the grandfather of. That horse also had the genetic sway-back Turabo shows, with thsame "tie-in" at the hips...

I had always heard that Turabo had a very bad disposition. The horse I had didn't have a very good disposition either and that is why I no longer own him.

Now, please don't get upset with me, I'm just giving my honest assesment. To me, his great grandson I raised here...is a way better built horse.

I had always wanted to see how this horse looked...thanks for posting him.

[motorgypsy]

What a HUNK! what is his breeding?

[cristy]

His disposition was man made. I have had 4 of his offspring, 2 of which I still have, and have worked with many more. They all have great dispositions. and they gait, wow do they gait. I think the special thing about Turabo was that He bettered the next generation. He produced better than himself. All of his offspring are like a stamp, you can pick them out of a crowd, imo this is what makes a horse a good stallion. Even his grand children still carry his likeness.

BTW he was Reserve International Grand Champion BELLA FORMA in 1995. so I guess the judges felt his conformation was pretty darn good.

[Cindy]

BTW he was Reserve International Grand Champion BELLA FORMA in 1995

Where? In what show and who was the governeing body of the show? Not questioning the fact, just want clarification of where he won his titles as that title name is forein to me.

[Terry Wallace]

BTW he was Reserve International Grand Champion BELLA FORMA in 1995. so I guess the judges felt his conformation was pretty darn good.

Oh...not neccesarily so at all...been to any shows lately? ;-) This is definitely a case to ask how many horses were in the class and who were the horses! Please do not think that a horse winning something on one day would give him "good confo".....

Anyone who can SEE confo...can see his confo is.... well, lets not speak ill of the dead...

I'd love Confo specialist Dr. Marvin Beeman or Deb Bennett to comment on him. I'm sure they would fully disagree!

He is certainly the type of horse I'd never breed to....
I would not want offspring that looked like him.... no thanks!
I can see 4 major, blaring faults just from these photos...

JMO.... not intending to argue... we will just have to disagree on this one!
And also that a disposition could be "man-made"...certainly disposition can be influenced....but not "made"..... ;-)

[cristy]

Cindy it was at the PPR show in Columbia South Carolina. I don't know how many were in the class but I do know in the early 90's that show was well attended (don't know about now haven't been since 1993)


Terry, I'm not offended. I will agree that is not a very flattering head shot but other than that I like his conformation. JMO

I did know him in person and I don't think his disposition was that bad, he was just a mentally scarred abused horse.

[Cindy]

And the PPR show in Columbia is an International Grand Championship? I have never heard it called and International show much less a Championship show. Am I missing something?

[Candice Burger]

:lol: Uh, yes and no.

There's been a show hosted by the Pure Puerto Rican Paso Fino Federation of America, affectionately called the PPRPFFA, annually since 19xx. Can't remember the first one, kinda quietly slipped up. It's a one day show usually held somewhere in the southeast, generally in the Columbia, SC area. So yeah, you, me, a bunch of us, have missed out.

The show is called an International Championship show, so the winners get this title.

The first time I heard about it was in 1993/94, can't remember now. A PR friend attended and told me about it. I finally found some info about it a few years ago and was able to attend last year and this year.

It's not well advertised and kinda a secret, so I might be killed since I told everyone.

[TrueStepPaso]

I really have to agree with Terry here.....glad she wrote it first, because I was cringing whe I looked at those pics. I like the size of his hooves, and that is IT (even though they could be undertrimmed). His neck is probably bulging from carry his monstrous head around....it looks like someone stuck a QH's head on a Welsh Pony's body.. :shock:

I'm sorry, I'm really not trying to be jerk, but I'd head for the hills screaming if that thing came near my mare.

[Candice Burger]

Umm, well now that we all know how we feel about this, let's try to get a little more clinical and put all of this into perspective shall we?

I'm really on a wind down and don't want to post yet another page full of comments.

So, let me be blunt for once (it really is my preferred style; I get wordy so no one is left bleeding to death).

First, for those who feel compelled to say every horse is a beauty when it ain't, might want to stop that blind practice. It only opens the door up to criticism. Take off those rosey glasses and get real for once. It doesn't help the horse, the newbies trying to learn, nor the breed to pretend that every horse is a beauty queen. If those in this group don't know the difference between a beautiful horse and an ugly one or one with good conformation and one with bad then I suggest that you say nothing until you do learn the difference. It's great to be positive and it's great to love the breed. I love it with my whole heart. If I had two hearts, I'd love it with both hearts. But I'm not going to say something that gives the wrong impression.

Second, for those who feel compelled to be honest beyond the call of duty, do it with discretion. Try to remember that someone loves this horse and believes in it. And try to remember that your own horses ain't nothing to brag on either. There's few horses that us realists could say really took our breath away. I'm still waiting for my prince charming, so say it if you must, but do it with a little feeling. And I'd head for the hills screaming if that thing came near my mare needs work. If our rosey veiled friends want to ooh and ahh beyond all reason, well certainly help educate by all means. Let's try to leave it at that though.

The majority of horse owners posting pics do so to share. I appreciate that because I'm always learning, so let's learn in a loving honest way and drop the crap. People we are world-wide read. I never assume the person sharing wants my opinion about their horse's confo unless asked and even then I assume that's insincere. Do they "really" want to know what I think? Isn't it time to display some knowledge about our own breed with some intelligent, sensitive reasoning? Not only do we want to attract newbies but well-versed horsemen too.

[motorgypsy]

When we came back to the US from Colombia we immediately went to a paso fino show and it was in Columbia SC and was heavily populated by PPR's with a few Colombians including a grey fino stallion who was amazing. This was in 1984 so perhaps someone remembers who it was. We were very surprised at the appearance of the PPR's compared to the Colombian paso finos we were familiar with. Many were large, rawboned, large heads and not at all refined looking.

Time went by and we bought our own paso finos and one of those was a massive PPR mare. We bought her for her size and disposition because she tended to hard pace. We had two wonderful foals from her by Colombian stallions. THEN little by little we started learning about the PPR strain. And we learned how to ride this mare and discovered that she's very fino with no range of gait. We also discovered that one particular strain of PPR's seem to have much larger heads and bone. Look at the pictures of today's show PPR's. They have large heads. I don't think they are ugly though. I've gone from thinking this mare is coarse to thinking she is regal, magnificent and powerful. Her gait is beautiful and amazing and smooth as silk. She's extremely intelligent, very healthy and very strong. All the QH people love her. She is just very different from the typical PFHA show paso fino in appearance. Her next foal will be a PPR because I'd love to have her clone, flaws and all.

And just an aside - when I was a kid in the 50's QH's had really big ugly heads as did TW's and saddlebreds. The PPR heads are small by comparison.

So, like anchovies, some people love them and some hate them, but I bet this stallion was a great ride flaws and all.

One other thing - for those of you really knowledgeable about conformation - please indicate whether a flaw is functional in the sense that it will cause problems later, functional in the sense that it may affect quality of gait, or just aesthetic like the large head. No I don't necessarily thing a large head is beautiful but maybe it means more brains!!!

;-) ;-) ;-)

[Kerry W]

Candice...you know a post like that will get the entire thread yanked! :lol:

I agree...I appreciate seeing these photos. I can most certainly see why he was so well loved! Thank you for sharing! The Volante Volare photo too...I learned quite a bit from both of these threads. :D

[Candice Burger]

:lol:

I'll take my chances Kerry.

[TrueStepPaso]

Sorry, but sometimes my thoughts aren't all puppydogs and rainbows all the time. I'm really not trying to hurt anyone's feelings here, but I honestly don't see how someone in their right mind would breed to a horse like that......if they love it for its gait, personality, etc....fine. Doesn't mean you need to breed him to enjoy him.

Anyone with eyes can see his bad confo/disproportionate head-to-body.....unfortunately, it doesn't just "end" at his large head.

Now, I barely comment on horses about confo because one picture doesn't always tell the whole story....but here were three, and it was plain as day....honestly, it shocked me that anyone would look past his obvious faults....hence my "shocking" reply...

[motorgypsy]

Again my request - aestetic flaws, potential health problems or possible gaiting problems??? In a generic way how about educating us.

And is it too hard to say "from this picture the horse appears to be/have" _____

[Kerry W]

Imagine what if they hadn't bred him? He produced some beautiful offspring! :shock:

[cristy]

Well thanks for all the comments, more so for the good than the bad :D but here are a couple more pics that show his head from a better angle. Yes his head was big but I still think it was pretty. :razz:

http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q310/cristy5513/zonapics309.jpg


http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q310/cristy5513/zonapics312.jpg

[Kerry W]

Very nice photos...also loved that one of Bayamo that Rafael took, that's on the other forum...quite fetching! :shock:

[Candice Burger]

Sigh! TrueStepPaso, say it with some horsemanship attached to it, that's all.

I love a particular line that is butt ugly, bad tempered, and produces it. I've bought mares just because of this line--bad confo and all--knowing all of this. Sometimes there's more behind a horse besides his uglieness that we don't understand.

Conformation is never seriously discussed because of all of the emotions attached to it. If I say a horse has a coarse head (check out the post I made on pasopedigree about a horse for sale--I thought I was being nice!) or is cow hocked, usually the receiver either doesn't know what that means and is insulted or knows what that means and is insulted. They can't move beyond and say "yeah, she's part cow, I know, but she never broken down and gave me a good ride everytime". Most of the threads melt down to a stand-off of nonsense. Newbies remain confused (like this thread) and horsemen get their jollies watching the antics.

If we are discussing coarse heads, then attach some meaning behind why that's a problem instead of just saying a horse is ugly. Neither side really diplays much knowledge and the breed looks stupid.

[cristy]

Ya know I saw that pic of Bayamo, and I was wondering if he would come to my farm and take pics for me! As hard as I try I feel like I can never get a good shot, I can take photos of anything but horses! Ironic.

[TrueStepPaso]

Okay....my level of horsemanship is something you know nothing about, so its time to stop throwing assumptions around here.

First off, like I said its not just about an "ugly head"....seems like this is getting touchy, because clearly my posts were taken out of context. I find it rather odd that I'd have to elaborate on such an obvious thing here.....when a body is out of proportion, you can get ALL sorts of problems...I didn't think this was rocket science, but here goes:

Balance issues
Gait issues
Collection issues
Pain
His hindqtrs are TINY....support being minimal, strain, possible hock issues if overloaded.
Throatlatch thickness may cause difficulty in collection as well
Topline speaks for itself
Blah, blah

Ya know, I posted my comment, and now I see that maybe I shouldn't have....in fact, I see why these "newbies" you speak of, don't exist.....because of this attacking. The only one who's getting their "jollies" with the "antics" seems to be you, Candice. Like I said, I almost NEVER knock a horse, but this one was freakish to me, so I spoke up.....Now I'm sure I'll get a page long lashing with witty, condescending undertones. :roll:

[Pasogirlz]

for those who feel compelled to be honest beyond the call of duty, do it with discretion. Try to remember that someone loves this horse and believes in it. And try to remember that your own horses ain't nothing to brag on either. There's few horses that us realists could say really took our breath away. I'm still waiting for my prince charming, so say it if you must, but do it with a little feeling.
This was not an out of line request.
First of all...I agree w/Candice...some of the comments could have been delivered a little softer....imagine if it was your horse. Let's put some pix of your own horses out there for the critiques and see how you take it when they pick it apart. Let's face it...no horse is perfect. ;-)

Second...not everyone is as educated about conformation...and may see nothing wrong....so yes, it is good to discuss it. But some comments were a bit overboard.....
We see newbies on here buy all sorts of confo disasters all day long.

Third...I know some pretty ugly horses out there making BIG money breeding....so beauty is in the eye of the beholder. In fact...I think we all know a World Champion mare that is not known for her looks..... ;-) But I'd still give my right arm to have her...or even ride her once.

Sometimes...I wonder if you ppl ever read your own posts? Do you have any idea how they come across to other ppl? :roll:

[Terry Wallace]

Sooo..anybody wonder why myself and so many others would like to see a GRADING board for this breed? :D

Of course what gets me the most is that we cannot be honest.
.

Just can't be that unrealistic. LOOK what is happening to this breed wouldja?

I think it could only BENEFIT from a breed standard grading board. Its long overdue, and sorely needed..... JMO

Having owned a horse from this line who shared the same back, had a nasty disposition, and no "motor"... I cannot turn a blind eye and say...
Oh yes, he's just beautiful.... I feel it is up to the breeders and owners to be the stewards of this breed, to watch out for this breed... to end the breeding of cull type Pasos wherever possible. If that is offensive to some... I cannot help that.

Some folks can see confo...and some just flat cannot. There is way too much "pretty horsie syndrome" from humans as it is.

There have been some really nice horses posted on this BB.... go have a look at the horse "Calco" for a comparison.... Just a thought....
JMO... aren't we all entitled to one?

[JennLM]

None of this has made us feel bad at all for getting a grandson of his.

TJ is sweet, loving, (loves Troy), easy to work with, level headed, good on the eys (if I could take a good pic of him LOL).

We are newbies and yes sometimes talk like this makes us feel bad, but does not dissuade us this trade was a good one for us.

He is a TON easier to work with them almost any horse I have had in all my years thus far.

We love him and it's all that matters to us.

[Terry Wallace]

"talk like this" is NOT meant to make you feel bad...its meant to EDUCATE... its meant to make you think, LOOK, be better able to see the differences...."question" popular opinion.....period....
;-)

[Candice Burger]

Well TrueStep, to you it may not be rocket science nor to several that have the experience on how to look at a horse conformationally, but I can assure you that MOST still don't know why certain body parts were discussed and what that means when it comes to function.

I don't understand if anyone is going to make a conformational assessement why not just explain why the cause of concern.

Balance issues
Gait issues
Collection issues
Pain
His hindqtrs are TINY....support being minimal, strain, possible hock issues if overloaded.
Throatlatch thickness may cause difficulty in collection as well
Topline speaks for itself
Blah, blah


To me, this has no meaning behind it except to demonstrate that you might see something the others wish they could. So why not just elaborate in a manner that educates? It might help others understand why the horse developed cysts and why he could only handle 30 minute rides.

[Pasogirlz]

Sooo..anybody wonder why myself and so many others would like to see a GRADING board for this breed? :D

Of course what gets me the most is that we cannot be honest.
We are asked to subdue comment to what MG's would like to hear... or say nothing at all if it isn't the ole' "hes' purtty" line.

Just can't be that unrealistic. LOOK what is happening to this breed wouldja?

I think it could only BENEFIT from a breed standard grading board. Its long overdue, and sorely needed..... JMO

Having owned a horse from this line who shared the same back, had a nasty disposition, and no "motor"... I cannot turn a blind eye and say...
Oh yes, he's just beautiful.... I feel it is up to the breeders and owners to be the stewards of this breed, to watch out for this breed... to end the breeding of cull type Pasos wherever possible. If that is offensive to some... I cannot help that.

Some folks can see confo...and some just flat cannot. There is way too much "pretty horsie syndrome" from humans as it is.

There have been some really nice horses posted on this BB.... go have a look at the horse "Calco" for a comparison.... Just a thought....
JMO... aren't we all entitled to one?

There is a big difference in saying the horse has faults....they all do....
And in saying a horse is butt ugly and I'd run if I saw it....

You can say....I don't care for his confo...it appears he has _____ faults based on the pix, which I would not like to include in my breeding program.
Or you say. Geez that horse is fugly, I'd never breed to him, he's a wreck.
Which do you think has more style of delivery?

What I'm trying to say...is it's all in the delivery....

I'm afraid to hear what you guys think of MY horses...they too have their faults.

[Terry Wallace]

Lori...I'm not disagreeing with you... I did NOT say that.... I was not speaking about anyone else's comments but my own.....

[cristy]

ya know what Terry, It does not make me feel bad either. I know what I have gotten from him and I know more so about what he has produced and I have never heard anyone else who has owned one of his offspring complain about their temperment and or their "motor" so maybe instead of just making know it all assumptions you should take a closer look at your colts dam. Just a thought. Now as for the negative comments (from all not just Terry), to E D U C A T E us newbies, don't you think it would be a little more mature if you could be technicial as opposed to negative and condesending? I would never use the term (freak, or "run screaming if it came near my mare") to a client or newcomer on a trail ride, and I really don't think you would either. Maybe it's just me but I don't see that as educational.


I think it would be a great idea to post pics of various horses and have everyone pick them apart but there is no need to do it if everyone is just going to be mean that doesn't teach us anything, I am more interested in the faults listed with a description so those of us that do not see it can atleast look for it. and I think you can talk about conformation defects without trying to put down the horse, just stick to the facts.

[Pasogirlz]

Lori...I'm not disagreeing with you... I did NOT say that.... I was not speaking about anyone else's comments but my own.....

I know you didn't say that...I just thought you were addressing me and I wanted to make clear what I was referring to. :oops: ;-)

[Candice Burger]

Thanks Lori!

And Terry, I agree with you all the way on this. If people who have a better eye for conformation don't say something, we haven't done much good have we? All horses have faults and if we don't start having good discussions about it nothing's going to change.

If folks are posting about how wonderful a horse is built (and really mean it; I wonder) and horsemen know better, I think it ought to be discussed. The breed is too small to have the luxury not to.

I'll iterate it again. If you don't mean it, don't say it. If you don't know, ask. If you do know, it can be said with some empathy both the good and the bad. I don't want to keep pretending our horses are perfect. It makes us out to be a bunch of fools. No more than I want to spend all the time bad mouthing everything that walks. It makes us look just as stupid that we can't recognize that heart and brains overcome allot of adversity. The Seabiscuit story and all that. A horse with bad conformation doesn't make it a "bad" horse. However it does pose some obstacle about management, training, and performance and these should be talked about.

[Terry Wallace]

Christy....just FYI..it was NOT the dams...they were fine.
Of course I look at all aspects of both parents... that is breeder responsibility.

I don't make "know it all assumptions".....I speak from experience.
Conformation is a FACT, not an opinion.
Had you ASKED for specific descriptions on the confo faults the horse had on this thread...I'd have answered them.
I do not feel I was negative.....I feel I was honest.

If you find honesty to be negative....so be it. Its been said a hundred times... there are no horses without faults... some just have worse ones and more of them. Heritable faults, IMO... should not be perpetuated if at all possible.

[motorgypsy]

In this particular thread I pointed out that I agreed that he had a big head and that we thought Puerto Rican paso finos were coarse looking when we can back from Colombia. I in no way ask you to refrain from criticizing anywhere in the thread. Long ago I did say it would be nice if people were tactful but it was not directed to anyone in particular. And since when have I ever made the rules of the board. I don't judge posts by my rules. I follow Lori's and that's the end of it. Perhaps you'd better take a look at who your critics really are because while you debate things I post with great regularity I have no problem with it because you're generally right. I appreciate your knowledge and willingness to share and have complimented you numerous times.

[motorgypsy]

And I keep begging for additional info so I can better evaluate a horse's conformation but I haven't seen it in this thread other than a couple of lines from Abby. Precisely what do you guys see and what are the potential problems because of what you see. I started a thread some time ago to post horses and get conformation evaluations but no one participated. And by the way Candice - thanks so much for your precise evaluation. Little by littel I'm getting educmacated on this stuff!

[Cindy]

Uh oh, watch out, sister Lori's on the move. :twisted:

And Candice is NOT the only one getting her jollys (was that the word? Too lazy to go back and look.)

And last but not least a great phrase that I believe originated from the small island of Puerto Rico (and now we all know why) "You don't ride the head!!!"

This concludes my totally irrelevent interlude.

:rofl :rofl :rofl

Bonus, I get to use laughing man yet again.

[cristy]

well Terry I did not ASK for any input on his conformation at all. I merely posted the pics to share. At this point his conformation is irrelavant he has been dead for 10 years, I don't think anyone will be breeding to him anytime soon, and as for those of us who have his offspring well we know what we have. I just do not appriciate you badmouthing his memory because you had one of his offspring who happened to have a bad temperment, if you personally had 5 or 6 of his offspring and they all were the same I would agree with you but this is not the case you only had a personal expirence with 1, I'm sorry but that is not enough to qualify you to blame him.


Side note as far as temperment. When my mare had her first foal she rejected it at birth, when I found them my Turabo son (Gelding) has cleaned the filly up and was letting her try to nurse. If the filly got too far away from him he called to her like a mare.

This gelding was our first Paso Fino and his temperment is what I fell in love with and is why I am in the breed today. And my mare not to mention is the only horse on the farm I will NEVER part with, she is the sweetest most loving creature I have ever met.

As far as his conformation He is what he is, I think his head is just a little large but other than that I just do not see what you see. As I said it is irrelevant, as far as I am concerned this whole conversation is more about principle.

[cristy]

Here are some more of his offspring. (yeah I am a glutton for punishment)

Cloe del Cumbre (Turabo X Mischoly)
http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q310/cristy5513/CloedelCumbre001.jpg

Annilita del Cumbre (Turabo X Mischoly)
http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q310/cristy5513/AnnilitadelCumbre.jpg

Carrfrecita de CDC (Turabo X Siete Pontencias del Brujo)
http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q310/cristy5513/Springer007.jpg

Tesorero del Cumbre (Turabo X Gitana de Montana)
http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q310/cristy5513/horsepics100.jpg

Palomo Rojo
http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q310/cristy5513/palomoRojo.jpg

Carroberto de CDC
http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q310/cristy5513/carrobertodeCDC.jpg

White Oaks Bayamo
http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q310/cristy5513/bayamo.jpg

[Candice Burger]

Talk to the Avatar, Cindy!

I couldn't be jollier...
http://forum.rscnet.org/images/smilies/em31.gifhttp://forum.rscnet.org/images/smilies/em31.gifhttp://forum.rscnet.org/images/smilies/em31.gifhttp://forum.rscnet.org/images/smilies/em31.gifhttp://forum.rscnet.org/images/smilies/em31.gifhttp://forum.rscnet.org/images/smilies/em31.gifhttp://forum.rscnet.org/images/smilies/em31.gifhttp://forum.rscnet.org/images/smilies/em31.gifhttp://forum.rscnet.org/images/smilies/em31.gif

[Terry Wallace]

Regardless of what you might think Cristy...
I will always regard Turabo as being...and I quote here "mean as a snake".
I will not regard what I was able to find out about the horse a few years ago, as being lies told to me. I very much think those persons have told me the truth. I experienced it for myself, so it sure rings true for me.

Personally...thats all I need to know as reason enough not to breed to a horse like that. If the disposition is bad, it stays bad.
One other thing you may not think about that I do..and that is his confo actually gives you a hint of his personality.

Yes, I know the horse has been dead for years..that was the first thing I found out about him. Suffice it to say...he was a horse I'd never breed to.
For me, there are far better horses with great dispositions to breed to out there, as well as far better confo.

Again JMO

MG's...that comment was based on the times you have said....
"If a person cannot say something nice"...don't say anything at all."
I find that sentence subject to interpretation because.... what some folks find as honest assessment...others find the same thing "negative"...when negativity was not even a consideration... honesty was.

Was I negative when I explained that my horse had displayed the very same genetic swayback for example?

[motorgypsy]

If I ever said "If you can't say anything nice don't say anything at all" I was out of my mind at the time. What I have said is that there are many ways to say the same thing and it doesn't hurt to say it tactfully.

And you are correct - some people take offense no matter how you say something. Then all one can say is "no offense intended" if indeed it wasn't. Ricky Nelson said it well when he said "Can't please everybody so you gotta please yourself!!"

[motorgypsy]

Bayamo is certainly one of those "LOOK AT ME" boys isn't he!!! Great presence!

[Terry Wallace]

Did you know........my husband was named after Ricky Nelson????

And..he DETESTS the name "Ricky"...he is RICK....period!! He was never a "Richard" and always a Ricky-RICK!

[motorgypsy]

Poor guy!!! Parents do inflict very unwanted names on kids. I always thought my name was wimpy.

[Laura S]

It's better than being named after Ricky Martin, lol!

[Linda Y]

My goodness...Turabo certainly passed himself on, didn't he? Most every one of those horses look like they were stamped from a mold. Except that chestnut with the white.