setting the head

[Andres V]

This is not wanting a fight - I am very interest in finding what others do to set head at poll.

I see some in dressage tie rein to when horse is out of correct head is held in but correct set releve pressure.

I see pull and release sometime

I see setting hand so is like the dressage rein tied, when horse not setting head it bumps but if holding head correct is no pressure.

I know holding head in will not work, so what does work?

also is bosal best for setting at poll or is bit better or to use both together?

When just bosal is side ring or bottom ring better for setting at poll?

When both bosal and bit, is rein on bosal on side ring or bottom ring when other reins are on bit?

How important is flex at poll for PF - for trail horse is less than verticle OK? How much to collect is best?

please can we discuss with not fighting:D

[Hacienda Del Sol]

Nobody wants to tackle this one? I'm surprised. Well lets give it a go....
Tying the head doesn't usually work so well. It's true that you may see this in some dressage training, but, I think you need to realize you're dealing with a different type of horse there. In order to set the head I think you first have to figure out what you want and what the horse needs. Is the horse holding it's head high, nose up? Is it nose up and out? Is it low and "behind the bit" or just behind the bit?
No matter what, you'll want your horse to be light and to respond to pressure, that is, to seek relief from the pressure you give. I normally start my horses with a regular rope halter on the ground, getting them to understand the basics of pressure and relief, then move to flexing and bending throughout their body. Once that's established you can move to working in a jaquima in bosal and barbada. If I'm in the saddle, I'll often use two reins, one to the lower ring and one to the side rings, that just gives me more options on how I'd like to bend them. For me, backing is a great way to aid in setting a horse's head. When I back, I make sure the horse is giving at the poll and rolling his neck a bit. I like to release pressure as the horse backs, releasing in the middle of the second step of the hind feet and quickly applying rein pressure again. I also like to use my body a lot in this, to aid in disengagement of the hind end and to help get him off his head.

Once you graduate to the bit, keep in mind the same lightness should apply there as to the bosal. Here, you can double rein again, one to the bosal and one to the bit. Again, backing correctly here is helpful. Flexion at the poll is important, for all horses, and especially for the PF. Of course, flexion through the entire body is important. Less than vertical, if you're talking about the angle of the head, is good for both show and trail. Collection, I believe is misunderstood. True collection comes from your seat. You don't want to merely push your horse into the bridle and then pull back on the reins, you want to ask the horse to come under itself, supporting that movement with your reins and keep the horse light in the bridle and bit. Otherwise, the horse will be slugging through the bridle and bit, slowing his footfall and eventually getting very hard.

[CarolU]

Thanks Jamie...that is a nice explanation and very helpful. I am no expert at getting PF collection. Your explanation helps. I'm assuming it is safe to say that a good headset is the result of proper collection and not the cause of it?

But, I did want to say that for some horses 'vertical' may not be the best headset, for show or trail. Horses with short necks cannot be vertical. Some cannot be vertical and break at the pole. If they are vertical they are breaking at the crest. If you look at the horse in the logo here you see a horse with a very upright carraige, breaking at the pole, but he wouldn't be able to breath if he were vertical.

[Andres V]

Thank you Hacienda Del Sol - now with bosal and bit 2 reins - one on bit ring I understand, is other rein on bottom ring or side ring of bosal ? Or is it matter what the head is doing - like nose out would be side ring of bosal and bit ring or is always side ring of bosal and other on bit or is it always bottom ring of bosal and other on bit ring?

I am understand riding with seat and collection. Mostly my horse want to nose out... I have only one with low head and behind bit so am use rein on bottom bosal ring and bumping to lift not using side ring to bring nose back.

Still mostly I have trouble getting nose in - its no looking at sky but not a nice tuck (?).

[Hacienda Del Sol]

Andres,

Probably better with bit to go with the bottom ring. You can also help that headset with one rein stopping and backing.

[cowboy ed]

http://s176.photobucket.com/albums/w170/captcook9901/Panhandle_May%2019/?action=view&current=DSC04085.jpg


i do a lot of the same things that jamie suggested. the lateral flexion work also gets the horse breaking at the poll, so it is a very effective method to get the horse supple. this is a picture of my andalusian stallion, taken at a cowboy mounted shooting match this weekend.

[Centauress]

I LOVE that Andalusian Cowboy Ed! :shock:

[ErinC]

Jamie,
thanks so much for that , you painted the perfect picture for me.

and Yes Ed, NICE HORSE !

[Hacienda Del Sol]

Glad that helped Erin. Ed, I'm digging that mounted shooting and your stallion, that looks like a blast---no pun intended, and no moaning from the forum needed!

[cowboy ed]

jamie, you are in a good location to get started in mounted shooting. CMSA founder jim rodgers is in scottsdale. our national spokesperson and multi-time world champion cowgirl annie bianco-ellett is in cave creek, AZ. there are lots of mounted shooting matches out your way.

check out www.cowboymountedshooting.com